Artificial intelligence is the future of unprecedented productivity and wealth, but for Senator Bernie Sanders, the decisive question is not whether technology will change the world, but who will benefit from this change. As a lifelong champion of workers’ rights, Sanders believes that the rapid progress of Amnesty International is not only as a technological revolution, but as the next main battlefield in combating greed and inequality.
In a conversation with Gizmodo, Senator Vermont’s position, who revealed that he had just spoken with an artificial intelligence expert in the world, his fears of technology to suppress wages, break unions, and enrich the billionaire category. He also participated in his concerns about the impact of artificial intelligence on our collective mental health and discussed the “Standard of the Day of Resurrection”, which possesses some higher minds in the industry that humanity can lose control of its creation.
The conversation was edited for clarity and coordinated as questions and answers. All quotes are literally and not announced.
Gizmodo: Senator, I have long fought for the dignity of workers. In an economy that is increasingly formed by artificial intelligence, what do you think should be the new definition of meaning?
Senator SandersWell, this is a very good question, and I don’t know that I can give you a smart answer to it now, but that’s what I will say. What I think is lost in the discussion about artificial intelligence is what we have seen over the past fifty years: a significant increase in workers’ productivity. Almost all the benefits of this productivity have gone to companies and companies that have developed this technology. In fact, the workers today, in wages in the account of real inflation, earn less, and I am afraid that almost all new benefits will go to the productivity of workers to people at the expense of workers. This is a lot of concern.
So, the first point to be clarified: technology and AI are neither good nor bad. This depends on how to use it, and depends on who benefits from it. Unless we change political dynamics, the benefits will accumulate for the people at the expense of workers. For me, this is the most important issue. I want workers to benefit from this new technology, not just the people.
Historically, I mean forever – in human existence – people had to struggle to put food on the table, for the farm, to grow food, only to survive. Artificial intelligence will change all of this, and we want to make sure that this creates a better and richer future for ordinary people, not just the people present.
Gizmodo: With regard to protection, what is the protection necessary for American workers to avoid leaving this transition?
Senator SandersI think we must clarify the matter in some formulation or the other, and some unions have begun negotiating for this. If workers’ productivity becomes, if you are, the job you do now has become more productive with artificial intelligence, I want the benefits to accumulate for you.
What does that mean? This may mean a shorter work week, a 32 -hour work week, which we fight for, without losing wages. Again, the main point is that workers should benefit from increased productivity, not only CEOs. At the present time, this is not the case, and this is what we must change.
Gizmodo: If the CEO said, “I have connected these tasks and I need a fewer workers,” what should the response be?
Senator Sanders: exactly. See, we must see that this technology benefits workers instead of only executives. So, if a company developed artificial intelligence that allows workers to be more productive, what we would like to see is a shorter work week without losing wages.
Other things that I am concerned about, which go beyond the economy and the possibilities of losing tremendous function, are very important issues: mental health and human welfare.
Gizmodo: What do you mean, Senator?
Senator SandersPeople interact more every day with artificial intelligence, with robots. What is the effect on mental health and human welfare?
If you spend your full day interacting with Chatbot instead of talking to friends or family, what happens to you? What kind of problems develop?
We know that in America now, many young people are having difficulty interacting with other people because they spend a lot of time on the Internet. There are people there, literally, people in the world of technology, they say, “Look, if you cannot make any friendships, if you are very alone, move to Chatbot and you can develop a friend there.” I am not sure that this is useful for humans.
Gizmodo: There is a feeling that people were lost, and that artificial intelligence contains our identity, and our role in society …
Senator SandersWell, do you know the expression, “The process was success, unfortunately the patient died”?
In this context, the system works well. We develop all types of technology: you will be able to do this, and you will be able to do this. Unfortunately, humans will be lost in this development. And they will become more and more happy, more and more unstable mentally, and more.
Therefore, we want to make sure that technology benefits humans, economically and emotionally. The driving force should be.
Gizmodo: Have you spoken to technology executives or experts on this topic?
Senator SandersI have spoken to the CEOs. Funny you mentioned it. I will not mention his name, but I just got out of the phone with one of the world’s most prominent experts in artificial intelligence, two hours ago.
Gizmodo: Did you share your anxiety? Did they give any solutions?
Senator SandersAll of them are different. an act. Someone spoke to him yesterday, not much.
There are differences in opinion. On several main issues. No. One: What is the effect of artificial intelligence on the economy? Some people say there will be huge losses in jobs. I tend to agree with them.
Other people say not much, new jobs will be created. It will be like every other technological revolution. Lost functions, functions created, not such a big deal. So people do not agree. It coincides with this not like the industrial revolution. I think this may be more severe.
The second point: This is not a scientific imagination. There are people who are very familiar – and they have just spoken to one of them today – who worry a lot that humans will not be able to control technology, and that artificial intelligence will actually dominate our society. We will not be able to control it. He may be able to control us. This is a kind of Judgment Day scenario – and there is some concern about this among people who are very familiar with this industry.
Gizmodo: Are you personally optimistic or pessimistic about artificial intelligence, for workers, for the sake of society?
Senator Sanders: This is a broader question. We have the worst president in the history of the United States in his position now.
We see, all over the world, democracy itself is threatened. We see a terrible war in Ukraine, a terrible war in Gaza. So I think this is not a great moment for humanity.
However, I hope – there is up and down – so we can turn this. Among many other things, he used the benefits of artificial intelligence and robots to improve human life. To make sure we can wipe poverty. All our people can have a decent living. This is possible.
The greed of billionaires control the process. But ordinary people must control the future.
Gizmodo: A final question: Do you think artificial intelligence can be used in any way to strengthen unions and workers’ rights, or is it a threat to organized work?
Senator SandersI think at this moment is a more threat. I believe that in some respects it is used in the way that has been used as bad trade policies in the United States in the 1970s.
In other words, what the employers will say is: “Look, I want you to take an amount in wages. Or I want you to pay more for health care. If you do not, by the way, we have machines. We have robots that can replace your store. We have got artificial intelligence that can replace your shop.
So I think we must mobilize the trade union movement so that we are militants to stand against the dangers of artificial intelligence of workers’ rights.
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